• The Queue - Effect Resolution In Dice Masters


    Let's talk Dice Masters effect resolution. I know this has tripped me up on multiple occasions, and at times has been difficult to wrap my head around. Thankfully from internal discussions and the discussions on our forum, the unofficial concept of "The Queue" was born.

    The discussion can be found in our forum thread: Cheatsheet/FAQ for Effect Resolution in Dice Masters. I felt the concept would be easier to present with visual aids instead of just in text, so I created this video to hopefully clear things up.

    I can't stress enough that this is an *unofficial* concept for resolving effects in Dice Masters, and has been inferred from rulings and the rule book. Your local T.O. has the final word in how effects work. Also, the third example involves Card vs Die text blanking would COULD be proven wrong by future rulings but I'm reasonably sure I have the interaction right based off of current information.

    If you have questions or comments, please feel free to share them.

    Comments 17 Comments
    1. djcannonmi's Avatar
      djcannonmi -
      Great video! I think this will help a lot of T.O.s and players, for sure.
    1. Jwild's Avatar
      Jwild -
      Helpful and appreciated!
    1. archivist's Avatar
      archivist -
      Nicely done!!
    1. Axyz's Avatar
      Axyz -
      Mr. Mxy is one that I would like to have further ruling on. His ability is a While Active, but the way you are describing it implies that after the Action die is used that he no longer has to be active in order for you to use the copy. That seems very counter intuitive. How would this play out if in your example instead of Polymorph, the Storm player had used Slander?
    1. gkpon66's Avatar
      gkpon66 -
      Thank you.
    1. Flexei's Avatar
      Flexei -
      Quote Originally Posted by Axyz View Post
      Mr. Mxy is one that I would like to have further ruling on. His ability is a While Active, but the way you are describing it implies that after the Action die is used that he no longer has to be active in order for you to use the copy. That seems very counter intuitive. How would this play out if in your example instead of Polymorph, the Storm player had used Slander?
      That's the thing, Mxy WAS active and had text when Poly was used and the same if Slander is used.
      With Slander, it would have worked out the same as Poly (assuming the blanking effect is on the DIE and not the CARD). Player uses Slander. Add Storm and Mxy to the queue. Slander resolves blanking Mxy's die. Storm resolves. Mxy resolves: the card still has text, so the effect still happens, Add Mxy's Slander to the queue.

      It's kind of similar to the ruling that if Constantine Hellblazer names a character (say Elf Thief) and DWiz hits Constantine. Only the Constantine DIE is blanked. The card still has text, so Elf Thief is still affected by Hellblazer. However, Prismatic Spray blanks the card. If that was used, Elf Thief would no longer be affected by Hellblazer.

      I think the way to think of it is blanking a die stops a trigger. Blanking a card stops an effect.
    1. Axyz's Avatar
      Axyz -
      Quote Originally Posted by Flexei View Post
      I think the way to think of it is blanking a die stops a trigger. Blanking a card stops an effect.
      That's what is getting me tripped up. If an ability is blanked, then all instances of that effect (including triggers) should be ignored/blanked.
    1. Flexei's Avatar
      Flexei -
      Quote Originally Posted by Axyz View Post
      That's what is getting me tripped up. If an ability is blanked, then all instances of that effect (including triggers) should be ignored/blanked.
      But once again, the die is blanked, preventing future triggers. The other triggers have already occurred. The only way to stop them from resolving after being triggered is by blanking the card from which the trigger originated. After the trigger occurs, the die's location (or text status) is irrelevant. Intimidating a die, capturing a die, blanking a die, moving a die to used.. they all stop future triggers but don't stop current triggers waiting to resolve.
    1. WeaponO's Avatar
      WeaponO -
      Love it Trubie. Thank you for tackling the hard stuff! More of these please. Because of the Dwiz/Venom ruling, text blanking interactions have been particularly confounding to me! My first question to WK would be for them to clarify when texted is blanked from cards and the functional difference between blanking text from a die vs blanking a card's text. I've been operating under the assumption that the only functional difference was in the case where there are multiple dice of the same character in the field and slander or cold gun could only blank the text for one of them. Both Slander and Dwiz target dice in the field but both supposedly blank text (Slander:Target opposing character loses its ability text until end of turn / Dwiz:While Dwarf Wizard is active, copies of that character die in the Field Zone have no text). If there's only one die in the field and it gets blanked of it's text isn't that equivalent to blanking the card? I guess they're saying in the case of Constantine's naming, that the card not the die "remembers". However, with Mxy it's not a naming situation but a "when opponent uses" situation which would lead to my second question I'd have for WK regarding your Mxy Ultraman example. I would love for them to clarify the meaning of "immediately" on Ultraman's card… does that necessarily mean simultaneously? It's possible that it means the actions have to be played sequentially (one at a time) in the cue before breaking for globals or other general "main step stuff". If that's the case, wouldn't Slander blank the Mxy die and his card text (because he's the only die of that character active in your illustration) before his ability gets to proc? I guess the question is when does Mxy actually trigger? When Ultraman's actions enter the cue, or when they individually fire? Simultaneous is a funny thing in DM as every effect must resolve fully before you get to move on to the next effect - meaning things aren't really simultaneous, although I guess they enter the cue together and are then doled out at the active players discretion. If it weren't for the Dwiz Venom ruling (which suggests that text blanking trumps while active) I would think that at the very least Mxy would get to use Slander… but if text blanking trumps while active he'd be shut off, no? I love the idea of the cue and think it's really helpful, but I wish I knew exactly when things got to enter the cue and trigger especially given the conflicting Dwiz/Venom, Storm/Venom rulings. Hope this make sense! Thanks again!
    1. Flexei's Avatar
      Flexei -
      Quote Originally Posted by WeaponO View Post
      Love it Trubie. Thank you for tackling the hard stuff! More of these please. Because of the Dwiz/Venom ruling, text blanking interactions have been particularly confounding to me! My first question to WK would be for them to clarify when texted is blanked from cards and the functional difference between blanking text from a die vs blanking a card's text. I've been operating under the assumption that the only functional difference was in the case where there are multiple dice of the same character in the field and slander or cold gun could only blank the text for one of them. Both Slander and Dwiz target dice in the field but both supposedly blank text (Slander:Target opposing character loses its ability text until end of turn / Dwiz:While Dwarf Wizard is active, copies of that character die in the Field Zone have no text). If there's only one die in the field and it gets blanked of it's text isn't that equivalent to blanking the card? I guess they're saying in the case of Constantine's naming, that the card not the die "remembers". However, with Mxy it's not a naming situation but a "when opponent uses" situation which would lead to my second question I'd have for WK regarding your Mxy Ultraman example. I would love for them to clarify the meaning of "immediately" on Ultraman's cardů does that necessarily mean simultaneously? It's possible that it means the actions have to be played sequentially (one at a time) in the cue before breaking for globals or other general "main step stuff". If that's the case, wouldn't Slander blank the Mxy die and his card text (because he's the only die of that character active in your illustration) before his ability gets to proc? I guess the question is when does Mxy actually trigger? When Ultraman's actions enter the cue, or when they individually fire? Simultaneous is a funny thing in DM as every effect must resolve fully before you get to move on to the next effect - meaning things aren't really simultaneous, although I guess they enter the cue together and are then doled out at the active players discretion. If it weren't for the Dwiz Venom ruling (which suggests that text blanking trumps while active) I would think that at the very least Mxy would get to use Slanderů but if text blanking trumps while active he'd be shut off, no? I love the idea of the cue and think it's really helpful, but I wish I knew exactly when things got to enter the cue and trigger especially given the conflicting Dwiz/Venom, Storm/Venom rulings. Hope this make sense! Thanks again!
      Honestly, the DWiz/Venom, Storm/Venom rulings confounds me as well. Since Venom is a "static" effect on the board and not applied, Dwiz targeting him _shouldn't_ matter since DWiz wouldn't trigger until after he's entered the field, and when he's entered the field he's already affected by the static effect. However, the DWiz/Venom ruling text is mildly vague... The ONLY way I can see that it works is if DWiz is at level two (1/3) and being fielded against Venom and UC Huntress. He can enter the field, be reduced to 0/1, DWiz and Huntress trigger. Dwiz resolves first targeting Venom, returns to 1/3, Huntress then resolves, doing 1 damage to DWiz, effectively bringing him to 1/2, which he survives.

      As for the Ultraman and "immediately" being used, that basically means after Kryptonite is used and resolved, no other actions can be taken until after Ultraman's basic actions all resolve. That means no globals, or fielding, or purchases or anything until after Kryptonite and Ultraman are all 100% done. That doesn't mean things don't trigger though. I still say the queue is the way for it to make sense and the triggers happen when the basic actions enter the queue. You then resolve them in order (chosen by the controlling player).

      It works the same way with simultaneous KO effects, fielding effects, attacking effects, and blocking effects.
    1. agentj's Avatar
      agentj -
      Thanks for this video. I would be grateful if you continued doing videos like this. Not that I want you to stop doing review videos I just prefer this type (rules videos I guess?) over reviews.
    1. WeaponO's Avatar
      WeaponO -
      Quote Originally Posted by Flexei View Post
      Honestly, the DWiz/Venom, Storm/Venom rulings confounds me as well. Since Venom is a "static" effect on the board and not applied, Dwiz targeting him _shouldn't_ matter since DWiz wouldn't trigger until after he's entered the field, and when he's entered the field he's already affected by the static effect. However, the DWiz/Venom ruling text is mildly vague... The ONLY way I can see that it works is if DWiz is at level two (1/3) and being fielded against Venom and UC Huntress. He can enter the field, be reduced to 0/1, DWiz and Huntress trigger. Dwiz resolves first targeting Venom, returns to 1/3, Huntress then resolves, doing 1 damage to DWiz, effectively bringing him to 1/2, which he survives.

      As for the Ultraman and "immediately" being used, that basically means after Kryptonite is used and resolved, no other actions can be taken until after Ultraman's basic actions all resolve. That means no globals, or fielding, or purchases or anything until after Kryptonite and Ultraman are all 100% done. That doesn't mean things don't trigger though. I still say the queue is the way for it to make sense and the triggers happen when the basic actions enter the queue. You then resolve them in order (chosen by the controlling player).

      It works the same way with simultaneous KO effects, fielding effects, attacking effects, and blocking effects.
      Yeah, that final response to PK's DWiz question said Dwiz could "save" himself by blanking Venom, even if Venom would reduce his D to 0... If this isn't an abnormality it seems to suggest that text blanking trumps while active and really throws the idea of simultaneous out the window. Active player gets to fully resolve the blanking effect if he so chooses first... I'm still up in the air about whether Mxy's triggers happen when an opponents actions collectively enter the cue, or if actions have to fire and resolve individually before his effect gets to enter the cue and proceed. I'm leaning toward the later but could easily see it the other way. Either way, it's great for you to have spelled out the example so clearly and hopefully WK can give us some direction if for no other reason than to save our scalps from collective community's head scratching!
    1. Axyz's Avatar
      Axyz -
      Ok so here's a new one. If I use Rare Knowhere and target King Black Bolt, will King Black Bolt still do his damage even though he will be swapped out?
    1. pk2317's Avatar
      pk2317 -
      No - he will be triggered but not exist in the game anymore when it's time to resolve.
    1. Axyz's Avatar
      Axyz -
      Quote Originally Posted by pk2317 View Post
      No - he will be triggered but not exist in the game anymore when it's time to resolve.
      But Mr. Mxy is no longer active, so how does his ability still fire off, even though he is not in the field?

      EDIT: Also see Flexei's comment above:

      Quote Originally Posted by Flexei View Post
      But once again, the die is blanked, preventing future triggers. The other triggers have already occurred. The only way to stop them from resolving after being triggered is by blanking the card from which the trigger originated. After the trigger occurs, the die's location (or text status) is irrelevant. Intimidating a die, capturing a die, blanking a die, moving a die to used.. they all stop future triggers but don't stop current triggers waiting to resolve.
    1. Flexei's Avatar
      Flexei -
      Quote Originally Posted by Axyz View Post
      But Mr. Mxy is no longer active, so how does his ability still fire off, even though he is not in the field?
      Gotta completely disagree with Paul on this one. The text on Black Bolt is still there, the card still exists even if the die doesn't. I think King Black Bolt's effect would still resolve even if returned to his card via Knowhere.
    1. Axyz's Avatar
      Axyz -
      Quote Originally Posted by Flexei View Post
      Gotta completely disagree with Paul on this one. The text on Black Bolt is still there, the card still exists even if the die doesn't. I think King Black Bolt's effect would still resolve even if returned to his card via Knowhere.
      I agree. This would be consistent with how you've described the Queue.