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Thread: The Joker - Red Hood

  1. #1

    The Joker - Red Hood

    While The Joker is active, if you damage an opposing character, deal an equal amount of damage to each character that shares an affiliation with the damaged character.




    Should this card be read as "if Joker damages an opposing character" or "if anyone character on you team damages an opposing character". I'm assuming it's just for Joker's attack. However, the part that throws me off is the "while Joker is active", since he needs to be active to attack, it seems redundant to put that in there.

  2. #2
    Joker needs to be active for the ability to be available. It doesn't have to be Joker doing the damage.

  3. #3
    Ok, so let's say I attack with 2 characters. One does 3 damage to a character, the other does 4. Both characters I attack are Justice League. If Joker is active, then both characters would receive 3 and 4 damage, totaling 7?

  4. #4
    The "while Joker is active" part actually tells you something else, other than that he has be in the field - it tells you that the effect does not stack - that is, if you have two Joker dice fielded it does not double the damage dealt.

    There is some debate over what I'm about to say, but it is my opinion that the "needs to be fielded" part of "while active" is actually the default for ALL non-global character abilities, and that any exceptions to this rule are, and will be, specifically called out in the card text.

  5. #5
    Regarding the follow up question (which was posted while I was typing)...

    I think yes, both characters would take 7 damage.

  6. #6

  7. #7
    "While active" means "in the field" (PS the attack zone is PART of the field)

    "Being fielded" is the Yugioh equivalent of "being summoned" not the same as being put in the field or even being in the field.

    Fielding something means "paying a fielding cost to put this character in the field."

  8. #8
    Just played a few games against myself. It makes my brain hurt trying to figure out the damage when Joker is active and there's more than 2 characters involved. Especially if both sides have someone from that affiliation. I spent like 20 minutes trying to figure out who should attack and who shouldn't.

  9. #9
    and that would be every copy of the die correct? So what happens if you deal say two damage to one Martian Manhunter die, and there are three of that die in the field. They all take the Damage right? and if you deal 2 damage to one Martin Manhunter die and then Two to another Martian Manhunter die does the third martian manhunter die take 4?

  10. #10
    Hmm...

    That's just made me realise their may be some subtlety to how this ability works.

    "If you damage" - does that mean it only triggers when you use a global or action to deal the damage?

  11. #11
    I think it must.

    Otherwise you get a loop:

    You deal damage to one character.

    Joker's ability triggers and he deals damage to a second character.

    Joker's ability triggers and he deals damage to the first character.

    Joker's ability triggers... And so on.

  12. #12
    hulk/Joker/Slifer One lightning blot to hulk he does 2/3 to all characters. Then Joker does 2/3 to all affiliated characters, since hulk hits everyone all affiliations get hit again for 2/3 damage? meaning one bolt for a board clear? oh Dave I get why your head hurts.

  13. #13
    No it does say every other character. So joker's ability only hits others not the original.

  14. #14
    Ok, here is a better wording for The Joker's ability, as I read it, and to help clarify use. "While TheJoker is active, when an effect or character you control deals damage to a target, that effect or character instead deals damage to ALL characters that share an affiliation with that target."

    This emphasizes that the effect of Joker changes single target effects to All, target effects, and while the initial target can be redirected you could not redirect the subsequent damage, as it is an "all targets" effect.

    To be more direct, all of your effects become splash like effects, hit one target, everything else takes damage SIMULTANEOUSLY. No loop is possible because the damage is effectively simultaneous.

    Another note, this is basically a redirecting effect, so the original source of the damage is still the effective source, Joker does not do the damage here.

    Hopefully that made sense, and helps clear up how Joker resolves.

    (I can't exactly pin down the "you" = "any card or effect you control" ruling, but I'm almost positive that is the case)

  15. #15
    It does not say "other". Unless DMDB is incorrect.

  16. #16
    So does this mean nothing happens when say the hulk damages everyone?

  17. #17
    Whilst I agree that wording is more clearly delineated, Shadowmeld, I am not so sure it is the intended interpretation of The Joker's ability.

    Ultimately I think this is one that needs to be put to the rules forum, as there is clear ambiguity in the card text as written so there will always be multiple possible interpretations.

  18. #18
    Well, he would spread the hulk damage to YOUR characters that match an affiliation with your opponent's, but other than that, no it wouldn't not INCREASE the damage done.

    This ability simply increased TARGETS, not actual numbers. The net damage a target takes may increase, but each instance of damage has to come form a separate source. The example of the 3A and 4A characters mentioned early was a good one. if they both hit avengers blockers, all avengers would take 7 dmg, but if the blockers were, a villain and an avenger, all avengers would take 4 and all villains (including The Joker) would take 3.

  19. #19
    OK that makes sense, but it could board clear if say they had an avenger and this looped back to the hulk. or maybe not clear but do 4 to 6 damage as the hulk would be hit again correct? I am sorry but I swear I am trying to wrap my head around it. It seems like an interesting dynamic and I wanna know just in case.I do appreciate the help Shadowmeld.

  20. #20
    If your opponent had Tsarina out, and you have Hulk and Joker. Ping hulk, do 3 damage to Tsarina, which splashes to hulk, causing hulk to trigger again, but Tsarina is already dead, so no additional damage. Tsarina takes 3, hulk takes 4(1 from the initial pinging). No damage loop is created from the Joker effect (a loop could be created from two hulks being on the field, but then again, what else is new)

    Numerically: 1 Hulk -> 3 all Avengers -> Trigger Hulk ability -> no other effect because Tsarina is dead.

    Now, say we were pinging something with a bit more defense... like Thor's 8/8 face. Ping Hulk for 1, All Avengers take 3, Hulk triggers again from taking damage, All Avenger's take 3, Hulk triggers again, All Avenger's take 3, Hulk and Thor die.

    Looking into a more interesting scenario, if your opponent has Thor 8/8 and Black Manta 3/5 and you again have Hulk (7/7) and Joker (3/6).

    Hulk 1 Damage -> All Avengers and Villains take 3 -> Hulk triggers again -> All Avengers and Villains take 3 -> Hulk,Joker and Manta all die. Thor lives on with 2 defense remaining for the turn.

    Let's look at Joker(1/4) and Hulk(8/8) on slightly different faces:

    Ping Hulk -> All Avengers and Villains take 2 -> Hulk triggers again -> All Avengers and Villains take 2 (Joker dies) -> Hulk triggers again -> Thor and Manta take 2 damage. Hulk has sustained 5/8 damage, Thor 6/8 and Manta is KOed.

    Hope these examples help, don't blame Joker for the headaches, it's all Hulk's fault.

  21. #21

  22. #22
    I have a dilemma so I was using joker red hood and my joker is about to use his ability but the other person says the card only attacks affiliated characters not the same character. For example I was attacking a justice league character and he had two identical dice out , so would he attack both dice because their both justice league or does it have to be a different affiliated card?

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Sdblake View Post
    I have a dilemma so I was using joker red hood and my joker is about to use his ability but the other person says the card only attacks affiliated characters not the same character. For example I was attacking a justice league character and he had two identical dice out , so would he attack both dice because their both justice league or does it have to be a different affiliated card?
    I can (kinda) see that arguement, but it doesn't say "each other affiliated character". It says "each character that shares an affiliation with the damaged character". Since only a character die can be damaged, "character" in this case refers to each die that has the same affiliation. A second die of the same character obviously also has the Justice League affiliation.

  24. #24

  25. #25
    Found that ruling you were looking for @Shadowmeld
    http://wizkidseventsystem.com/bb/vie...+control#p8798

    Lets gentlemen rule this as we should in the TRP community never GG and Red Hood at the same time. Take this pledge.

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