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Thread: Venom Deck, Thoughts

  1. #1

    Venom Deck, Thoughts

    Hey there friendly TRP people!

    I'm playing around with a Venom-centered deck that is either going to be direct damage or attack-oriented, and certainly control-oriented. The build I've settled on right now is a result of both fully embracing control (introducing Distraction, adding removal with Jade Giant, keeping the Deep Sea Deviant engine) and can be seen below:

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    http://www.dicemastersdb.com/team-bu...1272-3;5136-3;

    Basic actions:

    Polymorph
    Distraction

    Characters:

    Beast - Genetic Expert
    Black Manta - Deep Sea Deviant
    Cheetah - Cursed Archaeologist
    Toad - Tongue Lashing
    Death Stroke - Weapons Masters
    Professor X - Trainer
    Venom - Angelo Fortunato
    Hulk - Jade Giant

    The general strategy when you're going first is Manta into Cheetah into Venom and then just sort of pivot from there. If you're going second, the strategy shifts to focusing on ramping Venom out, so it's Beast into Venom which hopefully gives you the breathing room to stabilize.

    There is a lot of fun interaction here with Retaliation, fielding effects with Cheetah and Death Stroke, Polymorph spinning your Hulk, Toad and Beast down to spin up Venom, Death Stroke and Cheetah or even Black Manta. There's also the swingy and fun opportunity to Polymorph a Jade Giant into play for some Hulk-smash destruction. It's a bit - and Villain-focused, but Venom and Manta reward both quite nicely.

    At this point I'm not totally sold on the necessity of Distraction and could see myself swapping it out for Smash! (Pay one to nix a blocked character's damage) since Overcrush can be tricky, and sometimes I'd like to block with Venom or Black Manta and keep them alive. I certainly have the fists for it in this build, but I need to see if Distraction helps or hurts me more. It seems counter-productive alongside Toad, certainly (who, by the way, is fantastic with Venom when Toad's rolled down).

    I also feel compelled to be running more mask characters, which is why Mystique - Ageless is pictured and why Beast is in the deck. Polymorph, Distraction and PXG make more than enough of a case. I love the idea of Ageless on the offense alongside PXG, but the reality is that she's more of a defensive character based on when things are actually in my prep area. She's likely weak.

    The more compelling combination is Constantine - Hellblazer when you're going second and need tempo, alongside Doctor Doom - Nemesis which reads:

    Doctor Doom

    Doctor Doom can only be blocked by Villain and Sidekick characters.

    Global: If you have a Villain fielded, pay [1 Shield] to give a target character -1A and -1D (knock out those with zero defense).
    You're rolling in otherwise useless :shields:, and having this little bit of defense in the -1A and clutch removal in the -1D gives you a lot of flexibility, flexibility that often won't even be afforded to your opponent. The only problem is I'm not quite sure where to slide them in. I can forgo Beast in favor of Constantine and make my ramp more difficult, and maybe swap out Weapons Master or Toad for Doom, but that's a lot of sit-back-and-chip utility that I'm losing.

    Doom might be too situational and Constantine might just be too awkward. Constantine has certainly won me games and I haven't played without him yet, but I basically committed to playing him when I was going second, and sometimes found myself wishing he was a blocker instead of a delayer. Then again, when someone's rushing out a Spider-Man - Webslinger you're quite happy to buy a turn to deal with him.

    A card I didn't picture but which might have a home in this deck is Magic Missile, if only because s can sometimes be useless to me (Cheetah is the only target, and once she's bought I'm rolling in s), but also primarily because Jade Giant is my removal and I want to be able to use it indiscriminately. It also makes Doctor Doom a lot less interesting.

    I feel like there's a lot of playtesting ahead of me before I feel like I'm making the "right" decision on this team. Are there any cards I've overlooked? Am I under or overvaluing any card in particular?

    I'd love any help; thanks as always!



    Edit: I will say that Loki - Gem-Keeper feels like a villain that should be on this team, but I don't currently have a copy to play with. Loki's certainly attractive given he's masks, he's fat, he's a villain, and he's a sort of removal, but he's also looking at being in the Toad spot and probably doesn't have as much synergy with Black Manta as I'd like.

    I'm also thinking that Constantine and Distraction are a little redundant with one another. Maybe go with Constantine (over Beast), replace Toad with Gem-Keeper and run Magic Missile (over Distraction)?

    So much to tryyyyyyyy. Game's good.





    Double edit! Toad - Mortimer Toynbee might be better than Tongue Lashing, if only because I've been craving a four-drop and he's a bit more conservative. But again, Distraction sort of trivializes his action.
    Last edited by digitallimit; 05-14-2015 at 06:00 PM.

  2. #2
    Hey digital, did you listen to this weeks The Prep Area? We discuss a villain venom doom team. Ours is more casual, but it might give you some ideas.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowmeld View Post
    Hey digital, did you listen to this weeks The Prep Area? We discuss a villain venom doom team. Ours is more casual, but it might give you some ideas.
    I did! Are you one of the humans on The Prep Area? I actually combed over it a couple times before creating this deck and its many subtle iterations. Love the podcast, keep on doin'!

  4. #4
    Indeed, I am Patrick, aka the nefarious geneticist aka Shadowmeld. Thanks, good luck with the deck.
    Why use distraction if you have Beasts to block with?

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowmeld View Post
    Indeed, I am Patrick, aka the nefarious geneticist aka Shadowmeld. Thanks, good luck with the deck.
    Why use distraction if you have Beasts to block with?
    Would you say that typically Beast and Distraction aren't played together?

    In my head, I'm trying to play around Relentless and alpha strikes from my opponent, e.g. Webslinger/Wolverine or Thor/Mjolnir or any pairing that largely removes Beast from the equation while hitting for big.

    This team also doesn't necessarily want to or need to attack, and Toad can bring the targets if Beast wants to block someone. Maybe I'm overly afraid of Relentless or Relentless-like effects?

    I haven't playtested the build I'm sharing so far; up to this point I've been playing with Hellblazer, Resurrection and Doctor Doom () over Beast, Distraction and Hulk (defense, defense, removal). I know Webslinger put me in an awkward position a few times and Distraction could have solved that, as could Hulk (block, kill unblocked). I was also unsure how useful Constantine was being relative to a Beast block, but I suppose my opponent is more likely to attack into a Constantine than a Beast, so it's sort of fallacious to call that a sign to change characters.

    End of the day, I like that Beast wants to be spun down, that he's a mask character, that he has synergy with Toad, and that he's more indirect damage not to mention life gain. Distraction is just me thinking... I'm not attacking much, right? If I never attack, Distraction is sort of one-sided. And then maybe Toad just turns into a tempo card instead of removal.

    Edit: And hey Patrick! My name's Michael, just so we're even.
    Last edited by digitallimit; 05-14-2015 at 10:28 PM.

  6. #6
    So, you're building a villains deck. Stick to villains. Doom isn't better than hulk, but Venom is about as good, and doom's global gives you a lot of removal.

    I see you're worried about Webslinger, and the secret to that is to stop him from attacking. At worst you're looking at 2 fists and 1 shield or 3 shields to kill him when he shows up, If you're looking stop the damage from characters you can't block you could try the Mystic box swap. It's a shield version of Distraction, but also have some offensive utility.

    As for beast, he's not a villain and he doesn't do much for you that any other character couldn't do except for the 2 mask. perhaps look at other 1-3 mask characters. I'm a fan of Morphing Jar from YGO. either the C or UC one. His stats are definitely better than Beasts, and buying for 1 or removing your opponent's ramp is always fun. OH, one of the reasons I chose to use Mystique on the Shields of Doom team is that she is a villain that scales into the late game strategy of a villains team, you can attack with her and hope she dies with her early game low health to trigger retaliation and get your masks back into circulation. Also, by having her out you can do N-1 damage to your opponent by spending N shields to KO her while Manta's out. That's a pretty good rate of return for direct damage.

    Definitely a fan of Constantine, and more shields really helps with the other things I've brought up. Toad is a good addition to the team,

  7. #7
    Thanks for the input, Pat! Been trying some things out based on your response....

    Two updated lists, depending on your poison:

    Villains A

    Basic actions:


    Polymorph
    Magic Missile

    Characters:


    Psylocke - Kwannon the Assassin
    Black Manta - Deep Sea Deviant
    Cheetah - Cursed Archaeologist
    Harley Quinn - Dr. Harleen Quinzel

    The Joker - Clown Prince of Crime
    Professor X - Trainer
    Venom - Angelo Fortunato
    Death Stroke - Weapons Masters


    Villains B

    Basic actions:


    Polymorph
    Smash!

    Characters:


    Psylocke - Kwannon the Assassin
    Black Manta - Deep Sea Deviant
    Cheetah - Cursed Archaeologist
    Toad - Tongue Lashing

    Professor X - Trainer
    Venom - Angelo Fortunato
    Death Stroke - Weapons Masters
    Doctor Doom - Nemesis



    Psylocke - Kwannon the Assassin is the obvious revelation. She solves the ramp issues. She solves the removal issues. She's the perfect first turn buy that no opponent wants to see. She also sets up a turn-3 Polymorphed Venom relatively comfortably.

    Harley and The Joker are great for feeding your Death Stroke and Manta, while giving you another form of "removal" given we had to trade Toad out for the space. We could try and live that no-2-drops lifestyle and squeeze Doom back into this build, making room for Mystic Box in Magic Missile's basic action slot, but Kwannon is really just too good, I think.

    Toad - Tongue Lashing still proves fantastic, especially with support from Smash! and Doom, and obviously Venom. He's sort of tragically expensive to field and his stats are a little wonky for someone who wants to stay on the field, but that's why he's in the B-team.

    I'd love to give another build a shot, probably Mortimer Toynbee and Gem-Keeper over Harley and The Joker, but I have a feeling it'd just be a bit too top-heavy. And then there's the itching reminder that Polymorph is undermining both Joker and Loki, but who's not running Polymorph these days anyway.

  8. #8
    Really enjoy Villains B team for obvious reasons! Glad to see someone using the podcast to create a team. You're the best!

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