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Thread: What If (Theory Crafting)

  1. #1

    What If (Theory Crafting)

    As someone who has come from a more traditional CCG background, I have to say that my first CDG has revived my interest and enthusiasm for collectible non virtual gaming (*cough* No I dont want to catchemall anymore)..

    However, I do have one major gripe with the game as it is, and that is, as @Shadowmeld or someone else put it, how the active player retains priority since actions and abilities resolve instantaneously. Now while this is a limited issue in MtG, MtG also has the stack to allow interaction before a spell is resolved.

    Without needlessly complicating the system with a stack, what if the active player had priority first (that is able to act first) but could only perform up to one action before the next player gained priority and they perform up to one action, repeating until all players take no actions consecutively?

    Or basically, taking turns acting staring with active player?

  2. #2
    While I think that system would work just as well as the current one, I think the current system allows a player to plan a turn more effectively while still taking into account the randomness dice introduce.

    Think of Dice Masters like a chess board. For any given move you have all the information your opponent does, and often the results of that move come down to a dice roll. If link several of these moves together it doesn't really change the amount of information on the board as your opponent can't really react. If you add a priority pass between each of these actions, the amount of information you have after each action changes each time priority passes. Currently games of Dice Masters are already slated for 30 minutes and often go to time. If we added a priority pass, game length would likely double.

    To summarize, the lack of priority means you as a player needs to read your opponents reserve pool like you were reading an opponents chess pieces, then hope the dice land in your favor.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowmeld View Post
    While I think that system would work just as well as the current one, I think the current system allows a player to plan a turn more effectively while still taking into account the randomness dice introduce.

    Think of Dice Masters like a chess board. For any given move you have all the information your opponent does, and often the results of that move come down to a dice roll. If link several of these moves together it doesn't really change the amount of information on the board as your opponent can't really react. If you add a priority pass between each of these actions, the amount of information you have after each action changes each time priority passes. Currently games of Dice Masters are already slated for 30 minutes and often go to time. If we added a priority pass, game length would likely double.

    To summarize, the lack of priority means you as a player needs to read your opponents reserve pool like you were reading an opponents chess pieces, then hope the dice land in your favor.
    I had not considered this from the active player's perspective to be honest: only from the inactive player's perspective. The issue I have currently is that traditional control is really weak, primarily due to a lack of interaction available during the opponent's turn but also due to KO'd characters being rerolled next turn and lack of summoning sickness.

    The best example I can give is with the AvX Hulk (JG and GG) in conjunction with Magic Missile (BAC): unless my opponent isn't packing any removal at all, they could simply remove that Hulk before Hulk has a chance to take someone down with him.

  4. #4
    I think the problem here is not the game, but one's mindset.

    This is something that I realised only very recently:

    The reason traditional control is weak in Dice Masters is that Dice Masters is not a traditional CCG (or CDG, for that matter).

    It has a lot more in common with Deck Building Games such as Dominion than it does with Collectible Card Games such as Magic.

    This is something I plan to expound a little more on in my blog, so I'll not go into any more depth than this.

    But I will suffice to say that, as such, we need to approach control differently.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Scorpion0x17 View Post
    I think the problem here is not the game, but one's mindset.

    This is something that I realised only very recently:

    The reason traditional control is weak in Dice Masters is that Dice Masters is not a traditional CCG (or CDG, for that matter).

    It has a lot more in common with Deck Building Games such as Dominion than it does with Collectible Card Games such as Magic.

    This is something I plan to expound a little more on in my blog, so I'll not go into any more depth than this.

    But I will suffice to say that, as such, we need to approach control differently.
    I'll have to look for the relevant blog from ya then and as long as I get to blow the enemy team up, I'm all for any form of control (for the record, I do not like permission at all except for YGO Rock Stun: just something about cracking a Pernicious Deed that is so satisfying!).

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by ELC1847 View Post
    As someone who has come from a more traditional CCG background, I have to say that my first CDG has revived my interest and enthusiasm for collectible non virtual gaming (*cough* No I dont want to catchemall anymore)..

    However, I do have one major gripe with the game as it is, and that is, as @Shadowmeld or someone else put it, how the active player retains priority since actions and abilities resolve instantaneously. Now while this is a limited issue in MtG, MtG also has the stack to allow interaction before a spell is resolved.

    Without needlessly complicating the system with a stack, what if the active player had priority first (that is able to act first) but could only perform up to one action before the next player gained priority and they perform up to one action, repeating until all players take no actions consecutively?

    Or basically, taking turns acting staring with active player?
    This is how L5R deals with actions from both players, and having played that very competitively in the last few years I have found that this is how I play Dicemasters....

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