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Thread: Friendly Debate - Worst Card Ever?

  1. #1

    Friendly Debate - Worst Card Ever?

    I know I'm going to get lots of people arguing that Common Vixen beats out this card as the worst ever so far...but...hear me out...

    I'm putting forward that Apprentice Ooze is the worst card ever, strictly because Master Ooze exists.



    Here is the reason why...these are both starter set cards in the D&D set. So anyone who owns one of these cards, will always own the other. They are exactly the same in every way, except that Master Ooze has an extra line of text over the Apprentice Ooze. So why would anyone ever, under any circumstance, use the Apprentice Ooze? I cannot fathom any reason...can anyone else?

    In the case of Common Vixen.....I'd argue she is slightly better then the Cube I'm suggesting because I can still see a situation where some may use her. I could see her being used in desperate circumstances, in a draft perhaps where there are a lot of her die available, but no versions than her common available. Or perhaps even in constructed if someone is a big Vixen fan and they don't own her other versions.

    What do you think? Any other contenders out there?

  2. #2
    Harsh love for the Gelatinous Ooze, which is still better than Common Vixen. My guess is that Hawkeye - Formerly Ronin is the only card worse than Vixen.

  3. #3
    I should clarify...I'm not trying to be harsh or negative...just looking for a fun topic to debate. Some card has to be the worst...just like some card has to be the best...so which is the worst?

    @Wargfn . Nice call on Hawkeye, that is pretty horrendous, I hadn't read that one yet. Although, I could see there being some use for that, being such a low cost card, and perhaps comboing with other Avengers in someway.

    Apprentice Ooze just has no use at all...so I'm still voting for that one.

  4. #4
    I can see the possibility for future D&D sets including mechanics, that interact with the 'levels' on the cards, which make Apprentice Ooze useful.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Scorpion0x17 View Post
    I can see the possibility for future D&D sets including mechanics, that interact with the 'levels' on the cards, which make Apprentice Ooze useful.
    You mean levels like "Apprentice" and "Minion" and "Epic" and "Lesser" and "Master"...right? Totally agree...I've often thought that perhaps that was one of the original intentions of the first set, but maybe they just ran out of time, or decided to ditch it because it was becoming overly complicated for the first set, and they didn't bother renaming everything.

  6. #6
    I have a nomination: Red Skull - Johann Schmidt



    Now, what first jumps out at me is the atrocious fielding cost-to-stat ratio. The only character in the game with that awful of a level 3 face on a TFC-6 body is the infamous Ghost Rider who won't be seeing a lick of play now that we have decent 2 cost bolts other than Human Torch. With that as our basis, let's compare the difference between Ghost Rider and Red Skull in a Q&A session:

    A: Well, Ghost Rider is leaving the meta now that we have alternative low-cost bolts... how about we buff him!
    B: Yeah, that'd be cool, just make sure to make it a new character so we can still play the old sets normally.
    A: No problem! How about we give Ghost Rider +1/+1 on two faces, would that make Ghost Rider playable?
    B: No...
    A: How about if we gave Ghost Rider 2 lifegain every time he got knocked out (or give your opponent the option to take 2 damage, which they'd only do if they had Hulk fielded)?
    B: With that TFC, not a chance.
    A: So what if we gave Ghost Rider both +1/+1's and 2 lifegain?
    B: That might just be workable in niche strategies...
    A: Great! Since we've buffed him so much, let's double his purchasing cost!
    B: ...
    *Gunshots ring out*
    B: Feel free to gain 2 life.

    Lifegain just isn't a strong enough mechanic to make Red Skull work and your opponent would never take the damage in a million years unless he had lethal soon or could use it to proc more Hulk kills. With that in mind, the slight increase in stats from the Ghost Rider baseline is just not enough to make Red Skull playable with the incredibly mediocre effect.

    The other two versions of Red Skull actually have reasonably useful effects and powerful impacts on the game, but Johann Schmidt just leaves me scratching my head. The only reason to bring this Red Skull is if your opponent has the SR Red Skull and insists on playing it no matter what.

  7. #7
    It is Common Vixen. The fact she is a 4 cost is what does her in. Uncommon is better in every way.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Meatman View Post
    You mean levels like "Apprentice" and "Minion" and "Epic" and "Lesser" and "Master"...right? Totally agree...I've often thought that perhaps that was one of the original intentions of the first set, but maybe they just ran out of time, or decided to ditch it because it was becoming overly complicated for the first set, and they didn't bother renaming everything.
    Yep, exactly. And it wouldn't make sense to rename them because then if the introduce the idea later it wouldn't be compatible with the renamed cards. So, better to keep the levels in, in case they can make the mechanic or whatever work in a later set.

  9. #9
    Common Vixen, just compare her to Storm and Morphing Jar.

  10. #10
    My vote is for She Hulk Avengers Disassembled unlike the others she actually has a hindrance instead of something useful

  11. #11



    Ok, ok, ok. I know what your thinking. But hear me out. Everything else mentioned was a character. In Dicemasters, the goal is to do 20 damage to your opponent somehow. I don't care how bad common vixen looks, at least that thing can attack. But then there's cards like deflection. When you attack, you generally aren't in the mood to care if your characters get knocked out in combat, otherwise you wouldn't attack with them. But a basic action like deflection, which goes to your used pile at the end of the turn you draw it if unused. THIS THING. This thing is bad. It's a defensive card with rules baked into it so you cannot actually try and use it defensively. Common vixens for everyone, burn the deflections.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Osprey View Post



    Ok, ok, ok. I know what your thinking. But hear me out. Everything else mentioned was a character. In Dicemasters, the goal is to do 20 damage to your opponent somehow. I don't care how bad common vixen looks, at least that thing can attack. But then there's cards like deflection. When you attack, you generally aren't in the mood to care if your characters get knocked out in combat, otherwise you wouldn't attack with them. But a basic action like deflection, which goes to your used pile at the end of the turn you draw it if unused. THIS THING. This thing is bad. It's a defensive card with rules baked into it so you cannot actually try and use it defensively. Common vixens for everyone, burn the deflections.
    I think Deflection actually has a nice role to fill in teams that are using and abusing Ant-Man's global. That's an extra 3 attack per character if you roll well, certainly not something to scoff at.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Necromanticer View Post
    I think Deflection actually has a nice role to fill in teams that are using and abusing Ant-Man's global. That's an extra 3 attack per character if you roll well, certainly not something to scoff at.
    This is kind of embarrassing, but I typed that whole thing up and then remembered ant man's global, so I tabbed out of the page to avoid posting it since it wasn't fully accurate lol. Didn't even know this got posted at all until now.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
    This is kind of embarrassing, but I typed that whole thing up and then remembered ant man's global, so I tabbed out of the page to avoid posting it since it wasn't fully accurate lol. Didn't even know this got posted at all until now.
    Haha, it happens. I still think Red Skull is one of the worst and the game between Dave and Dan shows I'm not alone.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Necromanticer View Post
    Haha, it happens. I still think Red Skull is one of the worst and the game between Dave and Dan shows I'm not alone.
    Red skull isn't the best, but I have to disagree with him being a terrible card. Maybe it's constructed bias because I don't draft, but anything villain is good. The blue-eyes abuse that villains can pull off is like nothing else in the game, and red skull can be abused in the same way. Is it the best? No, but it isn't a common vixen.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Osprey View Post
    Ok, ok, ok. I know what your thinking. But hear me out. Everything else mentioned was a character. In Dicemasters, the goal is to do 20 damage to your opponent somehow. I don't care how bad common vixen looks, at least that thing can attack. But then there's cards like deflection. When you attack, you generally aren't in the mood to care if your characters get knocked out in combat, otherwise you wouldn't attack with them. But a basic action like deflection, which goes to your used pile at the end of the turn you draw it if unused. THIS THING. This thing is bad. It's a defensive card with rules baked into it so you cannot actually try and use it defensively. Common vixens for everyone, burn the deflections.
    I can see what you are saying. A defensive effect that is only useable when you are generally not trying to be defensive. I have always thought it would be nice if there were a way to save action dice so they could be used during your opponents turn, maybe this is something they will do down the road.

    And yes...I agree this card pairs well with Antmans global, but any card that is only good when playing with a single other card, is not a good card. And there are other ways to play with Antmans global.

    But Deflection is still not the worst ever. I still am stuck on my original post...everything else suggested at least have some use...but the Apprentice Cube just has no use at all...none...nada...zip...zilch...

  17. #17
    My vote for worst card would be one that seems like it should be playable, but just isn't. You may even try to work with it, put it in a team, and just regret it taking up a slot the entire time. It's super rare and even when it's niche ability can be used, it's still just really underwhelming. Of course I mean:

    Click image for larger version. 

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  18. #18
    @Flexei - YES. Dean and I were just talking about that one. Superheroes in general just fell flat. I think the general concept is going to live on in Teamwork/Teamwatch, and in a much more usable way.

  19. #19
    Can you believe that card is a 5-cost?

    I'd like to see the community come together with a top ten list. That way we can determine which cards are truly the worst.

    ...Maybe that's something I'll put together. Could be fun.

  20. #20
    So nobody will hate on the op she hulk the only way you would use her i guess is if you like the picture alot and had a way to give her overcrush

  21. #21
    I have to agree with the OP, why would anyone use that Gelatinous Cube over Master Ooze is beyond me. All the other posters have valid points, but those cards...yes even that Vixen card, can be used while the apprentice ooze just makes no sense...maybe if it was a cost 2?

  22. #22
    The starter Hawkeye, 2 , when fielded opponent gains two life... Nope.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave View Post
    The starter Hawkeye, 2 , when fielded opponent gains two life... Nope.
    I can almost see a strategy where you field a bunch of him early, while your opponent still has 20 life. Then somehow use him with other things to swing for 20+ damage in one shot...?

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by pk2317 View Post
    I can almost see a strategy where you field a bunch of him early, while your opponent still has 20 life. Then somehow use him with other things to swing for 20+ damage in one shot...?
    Possibly, until he is knocked out and becomes the only character you roll that actually comes up character more than energy

  25. #25
    So you keep fielding him, using him as a chump blocker while you keep your opponent's life at 20, while you set up your win condition.

    ...I didn't say it was a good strategy.

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