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Thread: So BEWD and AOU

  1. #1

    So BEWD and AOU

    Edit

    SO this post was about something else,

    But really it is about Constantine.

    I don't know how it became about Constantine, but it's really about Constantine.
    Last edited by Vapedaveb; 07-17-2015 at 04:28 PM.

  2. #2

  3. #3
    Batman, Robin, Pandora's Box and Black Manta. Spend 2 masks, every bolt is 2+ damage. Robin stays a villain for the rest of the turn, even if he gets KOed.

  4. #4
    2015 Canadian and 2016 US National Champion
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    ... So you can bewd him over and over. It's a hair slow in this form:


    http://dm.retrobox.eu/?view&cards=1x...retaliation%20

    But so I don't totally derail the thread, Iron Man Global is just as useful in this scenario, maybe moreso with Iceman TCFW

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by VastSpartan View Post
    Villain decks are veerry slow. But for fun its fine.


    But then you remember that he exists and that villains can close a game out in very few turns in constructed.

  6. #6

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Osprey View Post


    But then you remember that he exists and that villains can close a game out in very few turns in constructed.
    Not any more...


  8. #8
    2015 Canadian and 2016 US National Champion
    360

    Location
    Akron, OH
    Blog Entries
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    Gobby did plenty of work in World's, IIRC. And I think he did it fairly quickly. Plus, BEWD is a great combo with him for cycling.

  9. #9

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Vapedaveb View Post
    I see so many cards coming into the set that when KO'd has a significant effect, such as Red Skull, and the Rare Ultron Drone.
    Red Skull is rough because of his fielding cost. His common and uncommon abilities are wonderful but on his level 3, and many turns his level 2 face, what it costs to refield him often isn't worth what he did for you when BEWD KO'd him. Especially when your opponent gets to choose whichever effect is going to be less useful for you.

  11. #11
    I thought Constantine would shut down Gobby at worlds. Truth is, dedicating one of eight slots to slow control is a high price and Gobby was a champ at worlds.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by cbone3 View Post
    I thought Constantine would shut down Gobby at worlds. Truth is, dedicating one of eight slots to slow control is a high price and Gobby was a champ at worlds.
    I think has more to do with meta lag than anything.

    Many top level players work on their teams well in advance of any high level tournament. And, particularly towards the end, most of that prep is simply playing the team they know they will be taking over and over again against other teams.

    And those that don't take that approach tend to fall back on old faithfulls - cards they know work well together, and/or against different threats, and/or they are comfortable with, and/or have used a lot.

    So new tech tends to take a little while to percolate up in to those top level teams, unless there is a straight 1:1 swap that is a clear improvement.

  13. #13
    I'm not sure I agree. The set was spoiled in early to mid April. That gave almost two months of playtesting time to see if DC stuff would make the cut. I can't speak for teams in DM, but in Magic, new sets are proxied and tested as soon as they're spoiled. If top DM teams aren't testing new tech ahead of worlds, that would shock me.

  14. #14
    It still takes time for stuff to percolate up in to the meta.

    One of the ways DM differs from MtG is that we have 8 slots available to us, not 60, or however many it is now.

    So you have to have a really good reason to take one card out to make room for a new one.

    So yes, whilst everyone was certainly play testing DC cards as soon as they were spoiled, there really wasn't enough time to for a new meta to form around them.

    Heck, the meta is still fluid now.

    Also, it wasn't even clear when DC would drop for sure, so one couldn't seriously play test things one didn't know for sure would be legal.

    I was play testing for UK Nats at the time (which was only 1 week before worlds), and had to keep in mind that the DC cards, that I was testing with, may not have been legal, right up until it was actually released here.

  15. #15
    I'm not sure that having a formed meta is necessary. The meta changes based on large tourney results, where people unleash their new brews. I think Constantine just isn't as good as we gave it credit for. One person's opinion.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by cbone3 View Post
    I think Constantine just isn't as good as we gave it credit for. One person's opinion.
    Ah, yeah, I see where you're coming from.

    I just never thought Constantine was as good as some were giving it credit for anyway.

    It's a good card. But it's not amazing. Has very clearly delimited uses.

    EDIT: reading back I think we're basically saying the same thing - we didn't see as much Constantine at Worlds as some predicted because of several factors, including, but probably not limited to, the importance of getting maximum value out of every slot on a team, and the relatively niche value of Constantine himself, combined with constrained play testing, leading to his non-inclusion in many of the teams.

  17. #17
    Constantine was still the single most common card amongst top 16 teams

  18. #18
    Yeah, it was on more teams than any other card. It destroys "when fielded" abilities and buys you time. We saw plenty of it and knowing how to play around it is vital.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by alleyviper View Post
    Constantine was still the single most common card amongst top 16 teams
    I didn't want to point that out, but yeah.

  20. #20
    I have to admit, I never looked at the card breakdown for the top 16. It's very interesting that Constantine was such a factor (even into Top 8 and Top 4), and yet Gobby was able to push through. Obviously, it wasn't an issue in the finals.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by cbone3 View Post
    I have to admit, I never looked at the card breakdown for the top 16. It's very interesting that Constantine was such a factor (even into Top 8 and Top 4), and yet Gobby was able to push through. Obviously, it wasn't an issue in the finals.
    Honestly, Human Torch was the ace of my team more than Gobby throughout the tournament. That said, half the team was capable of getting Constantine off the board with relative ease (Torch, Deadpool, Grundy, Hulk) to clear the way for Gobby.

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  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by alleyviper View Post
    Honestly, Human Torch was the ace of my team more than Gobby throughout the tournament. That said, half the team was capable of getting Constantine off the board with relative ease (Torch, Deadpool, Grundy, Hulk) to clear the way for Gobby.
    The bit that hadn't percolated up, in my opinion, is how to make Constantine more than just a speed bump.

    But, I think I might know.

    And it may be something that's in the Justice League set.

  24. #24
    Constantine is defense. Great defense, but defense none the less.

    Eventually, offense will always beat defense.

    So, in the right team, Constantine can buy you the time you need to do something, but he is not a game winner. He is a... "game loser delayer".

    If I go first, and am playing an aggressive team, I wouldn't even think of buying Constantine.

  25. #25
    My game isnt just defense. Think of it as more of control. I also have that Wolverine on my Team. Ill be sure to take out Wolvie every change I get.

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