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Thread: What am I missing?

  1. #1

    What am I missing?

    So, I'm listening to the latest Prep Area, I was excited about this episode because I wanted to make a Starhawk based team as well. I mainly focused on Guardians with professor X and the BEG Sangan combo to keep dice on the board as much as I can. Anyway, I felt my own deck was a little slow, so I wanted to check out what better players were doing with Starhawk. When I saw the team, I was confused. It feel slow and clunky, both teams actually. They both feel like they have way to many fiddly bits to be consistent.

    Now, my own experience with this game is on the kitchen table, though I am moving across the country and will have a few shops to play at when I get there(even going to rainbow draft weekend). I recognize that my thoughts are wrong. These teams have been tested and proven, but I don't see how they work very well myself and I feel that this misunderstanding will lead me to just play very poorly and I want to fix that.

    Am I missing something about the overall game play for this game? I've been out of it since the spring and I don't remember teams being so slow looking. Again, I'm obviously wrong in thinking that teams like this are ineffective, I just hope I can learn what I'm missing and be able to play effectively.

  2. #2
    Nah, my teams are usually full of Fiddly bits. I showcase interactions and combinations and tightening down the teams is really something you should do to personalize the teams.

    With that said, Natasha, Starhawk and PXG are such a solid and speedy Trinity that you should be able to put a lot of pressure on your opponent. With this pressure, you should be able to buy enough of a lead to get your finishing move purchased and online.

    For guardians, grab a stinking cloud and Captain Marvel.

    For Swarmhawk grab an infiltrate. You may also start Swarmhawk off by going kobolds, Human Torch and Stirges, then grabbing Starhawk.

  3. #3
    I didn't mean to call you out, it was just the best example and a strategy I'm also interested in, haha. But I have noticed some fiddly teams, is this the norm? I also don't have much experience with deck building games, so some of the fundamentals might be lost on me right now.

    Personally I've played teams that have an overall theme/combo, but have a back up or an alternate win condition. So typically I don't end up buying more than half the characters on my team, or even maximize PXG because it feels awkward to spend so much energy on abilities that ramp into more uses of that ability. I guess this is just my own hang up though.

    So I guess a better question is, where can I learn intermediate/advanced skills for this game. Is there an article series here like that?

    Also, I apologize if this sounds disjointed or something, I've been up all night due to work.

  4. #4
    2015 Canadian and 2016 US National Champion
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    With as much building as @Shadowmeld does, while mechanically sound, these teams are not necessarily fine tuned for high level consistency. Maybe that means there are some fiddly parts, but the backbone is the showcase anyway. The idea of The Prep Area is to demonstrate some building ideas and show some cards interaction; by doing so, we hope to generate conversation and stimulate local meta growth.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Hypnofist View Post
    So, I'm listening to the latest Prep Area, I was excited about this episode because I wanted to make a Starhawk based team as well. I mainly focused on Guardians with professor X and the BEG Sangan combo to keep dice on the board as much as I can. Anyway, I felt my own deck was a little slow, so I wanted to check out what better players were doing with Starhawk. When I saw the team, I was confused. It feel slow and clunky, both teams actually. They both feel like they have way to many fiddly bits to be consistent.

    Now, my own experience with this game is on the kitchen table, though I am moving across the country and will have a few shops to play at when I get there(even going to rainbow draft weekend). I recognize that my thoughts are wrong. These teams have been tested and proven, but I don't see how they work very well myself and I feel that this misunderstanding will lead me to just play very poorly and I want to fix that.

    Am I missing something about the overall game play for this game? I've been out of it since the spring and I don't remember teams being so slow looking. Again, I'm obviously wrong in thinking that teams like this are ineffective, I just hope I can learn what I'm missing and be able to play effectively.
    The Team is slow. The prep area is based off creating decks that are more of a fun theme over a competitive one.

    All in all just comes down to practice and what die you need again'st your opponent. Also depends on your rolls.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Hypnofist View Post
    I didn't mean to call you out, it was just the best example and a strategy I'm also interested in, haha. But I have noticed some fiddly teams, is this the norm? I also don't have much experience with deck building games, so some of the fundamentals might be lost on me right now.

    Personally I've played teams that have an overall theme/combo, but have a back up or an alternate win condition. So typically I don't end up buying more than half the characters on my team, or even maximize PXG because it feels awkward to spend so much energy on abilities that ramp into more uses of that ability. I guess this is just my own hang up though.

    So I guess a better question is, where can I learn intermediate/advanced skills for this game. Is there an article series here like that?

    Also, I apologize if this sounds disjointed or something, I've been up all night due to work.
    Hypno, don't feel like you're calling me out, knowing that the teams I post aren't polished, or are a bit slow, means you are savy enough to know how to look at a team and find its weaknesses. This is a very powerful skill, and part of the reason I do what I do, how I do it.

    First off, the construction criteria for the decks I make start with these caveats:

    1) the economy team has at most 2 rares, 1 preferred, and no SR or OP cards.
    2) the main event team should relate to a theme card or game mechanic, and talk about a miriad of interactions revolved around that.
    3) both teams should try to use a broad base of cards, some that are popular and some that, while they have synergy, might not be optimal and thus get used less often.

    Using these three criteria, I build teams to showcase a range of cards that might spark players to try new things and broaden the meta.

    As you can see, these teams might not win even half the time, as designed, but if they can win, and are fun to play, I consider them a success.

    On the other hand, sometimes, I build things that turn into absolute monsters, like Apologies in Advance, my Little Cup team No Apologies and... (Calling it now) next weeks "Tarrasquey Business".

    Stay tuned for it, its a pretty solid team.

  7. #7
    Awesome, that makes me feel a lot better, thank you Shadowmeld. Also, I'm very excited about a Terrasque team. I remember wanting to use one back when DnD first came out, but it's been so long I can't remember the team haha.

  8. #8

  9. #9
    I haven't shared No Appologies on a podcast yet. It's a little cup Villains team that I save to play against folks who play the Mr. Anger Little Cup meta.

    Doom, Toad, Laufeyson have a good day.

  10. #10
    I think the issue here is that people (intentionally or not) made this team sound a little better than it actually is, and after listening to the podcast, I can see where the hype is being generated from. It's a very powerful idea, but you're correct in that it just takes too many cards all doing very specific things to be incredibly consistent. As Shadowmeld said, his job is making fun things for people to copy, be inspired by and create new things.

    All that said, Starhawk is one of those cards who is just waiting to be broken by something. Considering how Wizkids loves making the avengers so much better than any other specific group, it's only a matter of time before that could become reality. Heck, we've got a new GoG movie coming out and the next Avengers movies will be revolving around Thanos, so it could even be a GoG character that does it. It's one of those cards to pick up and hold onto for the future without a doubt. It's powerful now, but just wait and see what we'll be able to do with it down the line. Regardless, Starhawk has successfully become his own deck. (team?)

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