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Thread: Silver Sable - Vulture Counters

  1. #1

    Silver Sable - Vulture Counters

    I was lucky enough to go to 2 ASM rainbow drafts this weekend and by the end of the second one it has become pretty clear that whoever is lucky enough to draft Silver Sable and Vulture has a pretty good chance of winning. At least in my experience that was how things went down in both drafts. So, today I'm been trying to think of counters for that combo that would be possible within an ASM draft. In a constructed setting I can think of plenty of options but I'm having trouble thinking of much that I could have drafted to counter the combo. Anyone have any ideas?

    For reference here are the 2 card's text:

    Silver Sable: Hero for Hire
    You may sacrifice Silver Sable during your Main Step. If you do, target character die is unblockable this turn.
    Vulture: Adrian Toomes
    When Vulture blocks, deal 1 damage to each attacking character die. When any character die leaves the Field Zone, Vulture gets +4A until end of turn.




    So far thing that came to mind...
    Web Shooters: A Spider's Best Friend
    Ignore the text oftarget fist or mask character die until end of turn.
    */** Also deal 2 damage to that character die.

    Web Shooters: Webbing All Over

    Ignore the text of target fielded character die until end of turn.
    */** Also that character die can't block this turn.
    But since both of those are "until end of turn" that does not really help.



    Great Responsibility BAC
    Sacrifice a character to KO target opposing character (sacrificed characters are placed in the Used Pile).
    At a 5 cost this might be tough to get enough to be able to KO Sable or Vulture as needed, Plus there is a good chance they would just come back the next turn.

  2. #2
    At our ASM draft last Saturday, I was one of the lucky two jerks who got this combo working. Of course, the other jerk and I faced off in the last round. I won, and I did it without using the Sable/Vulture combo. Due to the general, um... ill feelings from some of the other players, it was a matter of pride at that point.

    Anyway, since that draft, I've been thinking of ways to stop this combo. I responded to a post on BGG from another player at our draft: https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/147...tag-teamed-sil

    I'll paraphrase/copy & paste some of my thoughts here. Please keep in mind, at our store ANY Basic Actions are allowed. Some places may only allow BACs from the ASM set itself, which will make things a bit stickier. Anyway, here's what I wrote on BGG:

    Transfer Power/Mystic Box both have a global that works pretty well (as long as your opponent doesn't have Shield energy available to switch the Attack stat he wants back to his Vulture). That's how I was able to survive a taste of my own medicine in that last game against the opponent who had the same combo. He also sent Doc Ock thru once as unblockable, and that ability saved me again.

    Distraction is probably the best answer for it. Just having a Mask in Reserve on your opponent's turn is enough of a threat to keep them from sacrificing Sable in the first place. Of course, that just means that they will wait until you DON'T have that mask.

    Vicious Struggle can help, but it has a few drawbacks. First, it's not a Global but the actual Action die ability, so it's slower and clumsier. Also, if your opponent can hit you hard enough to take you to zero life, then the game is over before they take their damage.

    Imprisioned or Phantom Zone might be good options (I can't believe I'm saying that). Vulture and Silver Sable have pretty low Fielding Costs (topping out at one each), so taking one or both out of the game until you can save up enough attack to finish your opponent in one shot might be helpful. For this to work, you have to have a piece of the combo in the field on the other side on your turn, and you have to be wary of any of your characters that'll damage your opponent automatically (like that Black Widow Aftershock we had so much fun with).

    Spellbinding Circle from YuGiOh can work. It is expensive (4), but you can play it on a character to keep it from attacking at all until it is KO'd. With all of the Sacrifice possibilities in ASM, however, it might not be as effective in this situation.

    Polymorph can work to swap Vulture or Sable out with, say, an Aunt May who might be skulking around their Used Pile.

    You've Been Chosen from War of Light MIGHT work here, at least in the way that it technically would work but really wouldn't be the most cost effective way to do something. You would play it, choose Fist as the energy type, then all of your opponent's Fist characters must attack on their turn. They don't deal any damage, and if you let them thru unblocked they return to the Field.

    Back to this post on TRP, I think finding a few ways to stop this combo is important. There was quite a lot of frustration about these two cards at our event, and I think that this game is only fun when everyone is having fun. That said, I'm going to play to win... but finding some tools and then making sure everyone else knows about the strategy and how to deal with it can only help everyone who plays have more fun.

    By the way, what is the over/under on Sable & Vulture (or a variation on the combo) being the new "hotness" for the Pro Dice Circuit events? I'm thinking it's probably pretty likely that it'll be very prolific. There are probably a few hard counters to it across all the sets, but I've been focusing on ASM answers for now.

  3. #3
    Thanks for the thoughts. Don't get me wrong, in the first draft I was one of those jerks too. I just realized there were not a lot of options for people to stop it from within ASM and was hoping I was missing something (like a character who I had overlooked).

    Our next event at the store that ran the draft last night is the PDC event so we'll see in 2 week who all brings it but I don't think it will be too many players. Guess I could be wrong and if so I will need to be prepared to deal with it Mera is my first though to limit the amount of hurt the combo can do.

  4. #4
    A couple thoughts on this:

    1. Distraction

    2. Mera Global to mitigate damage

    3. Gelatinous Cube. Why? Because pay a and capture a KO'd character. Now, you will need to find a way to KO either Sable or Vulture. I will leave it up to you to figure out a way you want to do this as there are many ways to accomplish it

    4. Rare Minotaur. Attack and capture a die? Great! You can also do this for each die. Same with cube. Minotaur works quite well with Distraction in this instance. Distract the Vulture back, then capture next turn. It is doubtful your opponent will let minotaur go unchecked with the high attack it boasts.

    5. Cerebro - Supercomputer. This doesn't counter per se, but it does heavily tax that combo as Sable and Vulture are 0/1/1 fielding cost. Just throw a couple of those on Sable/Vulture and you're set.

  5. #5

  6. #6
    Damn it. I drafted both cards, but being a noob I didn't see the potential. I’ll chalk that up as a learning experience. Wound finishing 2nd out of 4, so not bad for my first draft. I wound up going with a flood the field with cheap characters and used the common Vulture card and didn’t even add Silver Sable to my deck.

  7. #7
    Also, Invisible Stalker Uncommon can be sacrificed to negate all damage from an attacking character (when assigned to attack ability damage or combat damage).

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